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[paragon]

Instead of hard inability to resurrect someone from the different faction if your faction killed him, how about just asking the victim in all of the cases?

[cirn0]

Sure.

Also thinking about allowing instant replication after death confirmation box.

[Anza]

Not sure if instant replication option would be nice as it could cause balance issues when fighting in a zone close to a faction HQ. As fights can last some time, a character can regear and come back very fast.

If it is planned on purpose to simulate easier reinforcement then forget my post

[naossano]

Same worry as Anza.
Also, if it happens anyway, it is important for the victim to have the choice.
They might someone from their own team come back to defib them.
(it is reanimation, not resurrection, by the way it is implemented)

[paragon]

By resurrect I meant defibrillation not respawn.

Do I understand correct that you're talking about respawn timer?
I'm not suggesting to change respawn, I suggesting to let all be able to see a pop-up window (do you want to be reanimated) each time reanimation happens. If you don't want to, your body won't disappear faster.

I'm suggesting it because sometimes you don't mind to be resurrected by faction who killed you.

From the other side I'm trying to think carefully how is it going to be implemented and I don't think that defibrillation from your own team should cause any kind of response: it could happen in the last second of the respawn and you're not fast enough to answer. Or, if you're not in squad, you don't even know that it's your team trying to defib and not enemies.

So I'd suggest to make it different: auto-defibrillation from your own faction and answer required for defibrillation from different faction.

[Stem Sunders]

While I +1 the idea, I'm kinda confused about something.

Paragon is the perfect person to clear it up.

I dont know if you will remember but once Paragon and four others (Teela, count) were doing some ZC.
I came alone to have some fun.
When we found each other I was immediately killed, slaughtered in fact.
It was literally like a two second encounter before I was on the floor and everything turning black.
Paragon then shouted to his team "Don't take his gear"
I was then revived (I thought defibbed) I remember being very shocked and you sent me on my way saying it wasn't fair, because I was knocked down by spawning NPCs from behind before I could get off a shot.

Very honorable of you all, but how did you get me back up? :s
I was dead, I'm almost certain of it.

I know people say enemies cannot be defibbed

This incident is something I'm genuinely confused about, I'm looking for the screens now but there is a lot

Also have the same worries as Anza concerning instant replication option. And the additional worry of reviving your enemies just to troll them.
Of course I'm assuming that once defibbed there would be a cool down timer.

[Anza]

Another thing is that if defib prompts a popup window, it should have an effective timer. So you don't wait on purpose to accept defib. Timer should be like 3 seconds or so. Otherwise it could be exploitable :

- Someone dies in an unsafe position, rambo healer go defib him and comes back. Atm being defib like that means insta kill again. But he will be able to wait till the focus is on another place to respawn safely, despite the healer who defibed him being far from him at that moment.

- Fight in buildings/covered areas. 2 dead people -> defib but enemy pushes, the survivors retreat, the enemy follow them, the 2 dead accept defib and enemy is now in a bad position between 2 groups of enemies (while they should have the upper hand).

- Fight with many death, but a lot of defib happened. While the winning survivors FA themselves and start to loot, 2-3 opponents resurrect and kill them 

[paragon]

Restriction to defib applies only to the faction of the player who made the last shot.
If NPC kills you, he's not counted a member of any faction, so you can be resurrected by anyone even if they damaged you before.

[Stem Sunders]

Restriction to defib applies only to the faction of the player who made the last shot.
If NPC kills you, he's not counted a member of any faction, so you can be resurrected by anyone even if they damaged you before.

Nice, thanks for clearing that up.
It all makes sense now.

YOU HEAR THAT KOMRADE? Told you we coulda defibbed that BBoy

[naossano]

I am quite sure i read some day a changelog about preventing to defib members from other faction, to prevent abuse from people killing you twice for trolling.

But recently, i managed to respawn a noob from another faction (losing shitload of reputation in the process), that was killed by NPC. The guy didn't trust me enough to stay on the map, but the point is that i managed to defib him.

Having people choose if they accept being defib by someone from other faction, and being auto defib if it is someone from their own faction would be cool. If the defibber is a friend, or is friendly enough, they would accept. If the defibber is a troll, they would refuse.

A 5 second timer would be great too.

[Stem Sunders]

Even if the defibber is a troll and only intends to immediately kill you again, no real loss right?
You were dead anyway, and he can't do it again because of cooldown. Either way, I it think should be in there some how, not sure about instant replication though.

And I really like the rep system when it comes to healing enemies, its takes from your faction reputation but adds to the other.
I once had -5000 rep for BBoys, now is something like -774, soon I'll be neutral again

Never successfully defibbed one though.

[paragon]

Even if the defibber is a troll and only intends to immediately kill you again, no real loss right?

The reason why defib limitation was introduced is to avoid free score in ZC and trolling. Now we have only personal score / bounty (which is 0 after death anyway) and not ZC score. But trolling is pretty possible. E.g. defib him and hit his heels to exhaustion or block him is the corner with super sledge.

It doesn't sound like a problem personally to me, but could be a reason to keep defibrillation restriction for enemy factions at least.


And now 1 more: time to hit enemy in legs for couple of hours so somebody ragequite, and legs shot will finally become lethal.


Oh, I didn't see "Also thinking about allowing instant replication after death confirmation box.", so didn't understand what are other talking about.

I like it. It's your choice: to wait for possible defibrillation / go back and re-gear. If you don't like possibility to come 1 minute faster, you can lock character in his room / platoon base for 1 minute after instant replication.
But what's with armor / util slot item and ability to fast loot the body? are you gonna replace the body with different one?

[naossano]

Even if the defibber is a troll and only intends to immediately kill you again, no real loss right?

A loss of time, as the guy prevent you to do anything else for a significant amount of time.
IF the enemy can't defib you, you will respawn a minute later in your base and that's it. Then you are free to go where you want.*
IF the enemy kill you, defib you, then hit you so you reach negative hp, then wait for you to wake up, then knock you again, you will be their prisoner for 5-10 minutes.

That's why there should be limits for enemies to defib you, that's why there is a console command for suicide when your hp are negative. You aren't there to be toyed with by the enemy.

[paragon]

> That's why there is a console command for suicide when your hp are negative

oh, is there? which is it?

[Stem Sunders]

> That's why there is a console command for suicide when your hp are negative

oh, is there? which is it?

I used the power of Sugarman to commit suicide once.

Is that the command you speak of nao?

Even if the defibber is a troll and only intends to immediately kill you again, no real loss right?

A loss of time, as the guy prevent you to do anything else for a significant amount of time.
IF the enemy can't defib you, you will respawn a minute later in your base and that's it. Then you are free to go where you want.*
IF the enemy kill you, defib you, then hit you so you reach negative hp, then wait for you to wake up, then knock you again, you will be their prisoner for 5-10 minutes.

That's why there should be limits for enemies to defib you, that's why there is a console command for suicide when your hp are negative. You aren't there to be toyed with by the enemy.

Even if the defibber is a troll and only intends to immediately kill you again, no real loss right?

The reason why defib limitation was introduced is to avoid free score in ZC and trolling. Now we have only personal score / bounty (which is 0 after death anyway) and not ZC score. But trolling is pretty possible. E.g. defib him and hit his heels to exhaustion or block him is the corner with super sledge.

It doesn't sound like a problem personally to me, but could be a reason to keep defibrillation restriction for enemy factions at least.


And now 1 more: time to hit enemy in legs for couple of hours so somebody ragequite, and legs shot will finally become lethal.


Oh, I didn't see "Also thinking about allowing instant replication after death confirmation box.", so didn't understand what are other talking about.

I like it. It's your choice: to wait for possible defibrillation / go back and re-gear. If you don't like possibility to come 1 minute faster, you can lock character in his room / platoon base for 1 minute after instant replication.
But what's with armor / util slot item and ability to fast loot the body? are you gonna replace the body with different one?

Very good point I didn't think of it like that.

[Count Matthew]

> That's why there is a console command for suicide when your hp are negative

oh, is there? which is it?

I used the power of Sugarman to commit suicide once.

Is that the command you speak of nao?

That was the last thing I saw before the server went down.

Me and Stem messing around, killing NPC's. We went into the sewer and Stem committed suicide.

Heartbreaking.

P.S I can't remember, but do you get a reputation bonus when First Aiding an opposing faction? (If not, this is something that could potentially be looked into?)

[naossano]

I don't know about the bonus, but there is definitely a malus with your own faction if you heal a member of the opposing faction... Which can suck a lot if you are doing PVE operations with them.

[FrankenStone]

nah defib is fine as it is , only good thing would be if defibrilators would work from utility slot , to allow noobs more defib actions ...

[paragon]

Lol what, do you recommend noob to use defib in util slot instead of FA / DOC kit? you're evil

[FrankenStone]

sure , i only talk about experiences i made in the game , i can still remember that many players in the beginning asked how to use it and complained about the fact that it doesnt work from utility slot then i explained them how to use it , u literary need to use some old fallout mechanic to use it atleast and i think many of them never played original fallout games lel ... also its kinda complicated action just to use the item , its the only one from what i know which u need to use from inventory and there speaks nuthin against a comfortable use from utility slot how i think it was supposed to ... u trade off a medic item or grenade item for faster defibrilations , so its all right imo ...