FOnline: Ashes of Phoenix

Game improvements => Suggestions => Topic started by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 08:57:02 AM

Title: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 08:57:02 AM
If you're gonna keep this night bullshit for next season, then please add these types of scopes so certain weapons with this won't receive any sight range lost.

Maybe make the scope craftable or found in random loot and you have to craft the weapon with the scope. Also if daytime, you lose sight range cause you can't really see with these.

#notonightvisiongoogles #wherearemygrenadesgonnabe
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 21, 2015, 10:55:27 AM
Please elaborate, I don't understand why would there be a nighttime malus if you can negate it completely.

Unless you want to make it a sneak weapon exclusive and be like Tom Clancy's splinter cell.

#nerfsneaker

Nighttime malus seems to be an obvious attempt to make low range weapon more viable during "duh" nighttime.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 11:18:10 AM
Please elaborate, I don't understand why would there be a nighttime malus if you can negate it completely.
Are you that much of a imbecile that I must elaborate everything? It's pretty much common sense. And I as said, it's for scoped weapons. Perhaps making this scope rare/tier 3 would probably be the solution.

Unless you want to make it a sneak weapon exclusive and be like Tom Clancy's splinter cell.
#nerfsneaker
Not sure why you always want to nerf sneaker so badly. No RTS mode for sneakers = problem solved.

Nighttime malus seems to be an obvious attempt to make low range weapon more viable during "duh" nighttime.
Oh, but what about next session when a guy with a paper sniper build is forced to a close quarters fight? He can't reroll since free rerolls will be removed (fuck you devs). Especially when players come and have no clue on how to make their SPECIAL, 5 days later they find out a good build but forced to make a new character since no rerolls :(
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 21, 2015, 11:27:01 AM
For scoped weapons, rare/tier 3, I don't understand why waaaah sorry I don't understand why ? What why ? What is the point ? Why ?

Yes, nerf sneaker. Yes, I can feel it in you too. It gives you focus ... makes you stronger.

New player with random build. #wastelandisharsh
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 12:39:32 PM
For scoped weapons, rare/tier 3, I don't understand why waaaah sorry I don't understand why ? What why ? What is the point ? Why ?

Yes, nerf sneaker. Yes, I can feel it in you too. It gives you focus ... makes you stronger.

New player with random build. #wastelandisharsh
As always, making non constructive post. Kile urself
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 21, 2015, 12:42:32 PM
No, why ?
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: paragon on October 21, 2015, 01:02:39 PM
Obv imbecile is TS, due to being unable to normally communicate which is reflected in inability to answer questions without insulting.

> Oh, but what about next session when a guy with a paper sniper build is forced to a close quarters fight?

Oh, but what about next season when a guy with blind melee build is forced to fight DSR on Library Park?
Answer is, get rekt noob. I have no idea why would you expect somebody to be specialized and universal in the same time.

You seriously lack understanding of game design and unable to "constructive post" yourself, but in the same time you are poisonous to the others and thus damaging to the community.

Have no idea why responsible people still tolerate you, suggest everyone to report TS for the protest.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 21, 2015, 01:23:03 PM
they see me rollin' they hatin' ...  :-*
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 01:57:26 PM
bitch comment
(https://media.giphy.com/media/VbEm527MB5ks0/giphy.gif)

No, why ?
(https://media0.giphy.com/media/Z0dvuZszc3r3i/200_s.gif)

they see me rollin' they hatin' ...  :-*
(http://i.imgur.com/zrJeG.jpg)

On a serious note :

Obv imbecile is TS, due to being unable to normally communicate which is reflected in inability to answer questions without insulting.
Actually I can communicate constructively but I'm on your ignore list therefore you can't see all my post. Now I have no idea why I'm your ignore list (cause you're a bitch probably xd)

Oh, but what about next season when a guy with blind melee build is forced to fight DSR on Library Park?
Answer is, get rekt noob. I have no idea why would you expect somebody to be specialized and universal in the same time.
Oh, why you gotta copy my layout? I know you idolized me when I was a V-tec :D

Answer is : Smoke Grenades and Grenade Pistol/Milkor with smoke ammo. There are also buildings right part and center sooo....

You seriously lack understanding of game design and unable to "constructive post" yourself, but in the same time you are poisonous to the others and thus damaging to the community.
You have eyes but cannot see. Have you ever thought that I'm poisonous through your eyes but others see me as a different person. And as I stated before, you can't see all my post cause since I'm on your ignore list.

Have no idea why responsible people still tolerate you, suggest everyone to report TS for the protest.
Because they're not bitches and know me :D

Now you're gonna come here and post and won't stop till you're finally "right" Please talk about the suggestion other than unnecessary flaming/shitposting.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: MARXMAN on October 21, 2015, 02:15:09 PM
Please talk about the suggestion other than unnecessary flaming/shitposting.


You are most definitely calling the Kettle black.  You post a .gif to call someone a faggot, which leaves a bad taste in my mouth personally (You're still an intolerant fuck because you can't seem to stop insulting gay people). You respond to posts like this is 4chan, he's not the only one shitposting.



Also, like others have said, why the fuck negate nighttime malus? Seriously, its a debuff due to the natural world and makes combat much more dynamic b/c its not always a perfect situation for people.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 21, 2015, 02:15:32 PM
You might be having fun answering people with insults while stroking your ego but I still don't know why would you want to add an item to negate nighttime malus. Especially when you use the example of sniper build as an argument.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 21, 2015, 02:25:31 PM
You are most definitely calling the Kettle black.  You post a .gif to call someone a faggot, which leaves a bad taste in my mouth personally (You're still an intolerant fuck because you can't seem to stop insulting gay people). You respond to posts like this is 4chan, he's not the only one shitposting.
Fight fire with fire. Also I never knew paragon was a homosexual. If I knew this, I wouldn't have posted that gif but the damage is already done seeing how I triggered you.

BTW : If you think I'm terrible, don't read Reloaded forum PvP unless you want to get like 5000x triggered.

Also, like others have said, why the fuck negate nighttime malus? Seriously, its a debuff due to the natural world and makes combat much more dynamic b/c its not always a perfect situation for people.
"Makes combat more dynamic"

half the time me and other snipers are just saying its total bullshit during PvP. Now I see nothing wrong with adding a scope to negate this if it will be rare. It will be sort of like a legendary weapon where taking it will be risky.

Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: naossano on October 21, 2015, 03:59:58 PM
Especially when players come and have no clue on how to make their SPECIAL, 5 days later they find out a good build but forced to make a new character since no rerolls :(
You know, it is not because something has a cost that it doesn't exist. It is even the opposite. It wouldn't have a cost if it didn't exist.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: RazorRamon on October 21, 2015, 04:20:04 PM
whats night vision for on an empty server?
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 21, 2015, 04:36:02 PM
whats night vision for on an empty server?

to see upcomming npcs better in nighttime
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Teela on October 21, 2015, 07:31:12 PM
What is wrong with this guy?
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: MARXMAN on October 21, 2015, 10:25:28 PM
Also, like others have said, why the fuck negate nighttime malus? Seriously, its a debuff due to the natural world and makes combat much more dynamic b/c its not always a perfect situation for people.
"Makes combat more dynamic"

half the time me and other snipers are just saying its total bullshit during PvP
. Now I see nothing wrong with adding a scope to negate this if it will be rare. It will be sort of like a legendary weapon where taking it will be risky.


This right here is why I'm 100 percent okay with it. It gives other weapon types a time to shine, b/c during the day the current meta seems to be teams of snipers hitting diff limbs and causing something like 200+bleed. Even if you make it ultra rare, we have types like Hellmoi who is seemingly always online grinding to get shit. No matter how rare you make it, something that negates snipers nighttime malus would absolutely wreck nightfighting IMO.


Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: antohha on October 21, 2015, 10:59:15 PM
Did you try Sniper's max sight range instakill BG sniper build v 2.1? Works fine for me...
(Hint. make 15 PE +10CHA + hawk eyes)
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 21, 2015, 11:01:27 PM
Also, like others have said, why the fuck negate nighttime malus? Seriously, its a debuff due to the natural world and makes combat much more dynamic b/c its not always a perfect situation for people.
"Makes combat more dynamic"

half the time me and other snipers are just saying its total bullshit during PvP
. Now I see nothing wrong with adding a scope to negate this if it will be rare. It will be sort of like a legendary weapon where taking it will be risky.


This right here is why I'm 100 percent okay with it. It gives other weapon types a time to shine, b/c during the day the current meta seems to be teams of snipers hitting diff limbs and causing something like 200+bleed. Even if you make it ultra rare, we have types like Hellmoi who is seemingly always online grinding to get shit. No matter how rare you make it, something that negates snipers nighttime malus would absolutely wreck nightfighting IMO.

i dont agree on this , gameplay is same at night and at day ingame because mechanics doenst change during that only your field of view gets rekt and thats all , i would even go so far to say that weapons with the ability to ctrl burst are in night OP . because like i said everything else in terms of gamemechanics stays the same and u can easily hexshoot some hex that is outside the field of view but still in your field of effective range which probably means that the enemy cant even see from where the bullets comming from , moreover your sniperchar doenst have this ability with a singleshooting weapon ... still some critical singleshot weapon build can pick one of many strong pistols out to shoot something thats in range . so in the end this nighttime  fov limitation is nothing more than annoying to atleast 90% of players (if not even more) . also devs should keep in mind that Perception in classic fallout game doesnt describe only some imaginative characters ability to see something , it was meant to describe all possible senses as far as your imagination goes . just as reminder even fallout 1 and 2 had something similar ingame which just reduces your chance to actually hit a target at nighttime , but not such stupid field of view limitation (and theres a reason for that) .
also not to mention wicked calculation for nighttime field of view reduction , which does calculate four eyez trait scoped weapon trait field of view bonus as malus (which isnt even logical or realistic) .


to me atleast tunnelvision in a game which uses a hexsystem is already annoying as fuck since u got so much dead angles which doenst sound bad in first moment but when u look close at it then u realise that it is retarded in a game which uses a hexagonal mask for movements , moreover in combination with not updating fov while tunring your char makes this even more pain ... not to mention dead angles again in terms of aimed shots especially when your goal is to hit the eyez ... which isnt really possible with your max eff range because of huge dead angles and the lovely hexagonal system .

so in the end you got 2 annyoing features for what ?

nighttime field of view reduction for realism with unrealistic calculations ?

or

tunnelvision for realism but unrealistic circumstances like not updating fov in combination with the non existent possibility to have a straight line due to dead angles and the engines hexagonal system ?

or they juts there to troll us or or or ...

to nerf a whole character class in night ??? which doenst even make sense since there are better tools and ways for balancing purposes ...

so im just analyzing and questioning .

also back to realism and field of view in real life i can see as far in night as in day only thing which makes it different is the available light still the ability on how far i can see doesnt change anatomically because my eyez doenst shrink in real life in night , so you would make field of view ingame if u want to make it realisitic dependant on all surounding lightsources which is impossible with that engine ... in end this whole thing doenst make sense in AoP ...

also your meta assumptions is totally wrong , you ever heard of daytime night stuff ? which is called smoke ? atleast its realistic and there are other ways to play the game then just as a sniper ... from what i see snipers character idea is to max its range while it suffers at close range fights due to perks , traits and special options (yeah thx to whoever created the SPECIAL system , atleast he wasnt dumb ... tim cain :* ). why even nerf this more with stupid nonsense features which arent even connected with the special system directly .

you could also ask why there are no other "timeframe" dependant nerfs for close range builds or any other non ranged chars , like -% BTH at daytime becasue sun is too close and blending you if enemy wears an armor which is made out of shining parts % even higher ... so this game can become finally some real timewasting stupid game where some basic timeframe function determine what build is more effective , why this game even does have the special system when we can go this way ? yeah im serious and seriously this whole nightime , tunnelvision stuff is bullshit big BULLSHIT .

its really a straight nerf to just that one character class , it would be ok if it wouldnt be so . but in the end it is and really i dont want to encounter this "nah lets wait for 5 minutes till it turns day" while playing the game any time soon or after wipe , its already really big BULLSHIT and action is hard to find already without this forced wating time , so yeah its most stupid change ever ... atleast to me . i always imagine that some of the devs played too much bad zombie games and thought yeah this is cool . fuck that serious ... your game is based on some cloned pen n paper game conversion engine , shit like this wont work here unless you change the code and change the relations like high PE wont make your fov malus that big in night and low PE would make it bigger but then again it would be already the same like having low fov with low PE or high fov with high PE , atleast it would be much more fair in terms of not taking the sniper class range thing while fov reduction would still be there in terms of "realism" you could easy use some linear function for that with some common PE value form snipers as a starting value (for example maybe 10 as max PE and then scale it down from there on dependant on what u wanna archieve) ... to me it really looks like just somebody had some non existeng thoughts on already existent relations from gamemechanics in general on mind and (a) bad idea(s) were just impletended becasue someone thought it would be cool without giving a fuck because its not like that sniper weapons are that imbalanced atm like tehy were at the beginning of the season start or that u can instagib someone alone like u can do easy with other close range stuff.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 22, 2015, 01:28:03 AM
Well said courier.

whats night vision for on an empty server?
Next season pl0x
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: ProfessorYanick on October 22, 2015, 01:32:00 AM
Just the amount of criticism towards nighttime malus shows that it is a decent feature. It would be not honest to say it doesn't irritate me in my sniping exercises, but I can't say that it is bad. Tunnel vision and nighttime malus do not let snipers feel themselve overconfident and increase value of teamplay which is the game about. Once there is a build with which a person could feel calm and confident in any situation it means the balance is destroyed. I think some work could be invested in polishing those features, but their general existence is not discussable.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 22, 2015, 01:52:44 AM
Courier, your wall of text is basically saying : nighttime malus is buffing low range weapon (mostly burst weapon) and nerfing long range weapon (mostly sniper weapon).

I would like to tell you that well it seems to be obviously the point of nighttime malus to make low range weapon more viable during "tuturu" nighttime.

I see that you ask why these maluses. Well if you take a look with some perspective, even with these maluses, players are still using sniper weapons without using myself as an example, I can see stalker and his "friends" using snipers, mssniper using snipers (even in close range, pls...). I wonder why didn't you take these examples into consideration.

I think overall there is a huge problem called lack of adaptation in some players. Obviously, nighttime can be a pain if you are a playing a very specialized sniper build but there are multiple solutions.

Solution 1, use a build that take nighttime into consideration and allow to use weapons that make up for it.
Solution 2, not fight during nighttime.
Solution 3, fight anyway.

Funny thing is this should be the similar thought process about fighting inside buildings. 1 build with CQC consideration 2 not fight 3 fight anyway.

We could go on for a while like this on every feature, every mechanic.

Smoke, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?
Leadership, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?
Legendary, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?
Freeshot, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?
Easymove, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?
Gear, do you make up for it ? do you use it ? do you fight anyway ?

Back to the topic, Well said Courier (^_^)b. Good analysis. You even understand realism is just an excuse to add such feature and not the true purpose. How dare them to nerf sniper class.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 22, 2015, 02:32:01 AM
well i also have this not free rerolls for next season in mind and thinking about that in connection with this current gamemechanic makes me sad , all other builds are fine while sniper will be probably a nogo (atleast at night) , atleast to someone who just wants fun ... because all other shit is viable ingame in any give circumstances ... u dont need cqc builds inside a building to be deadly , u can also just leave the building if u want while u cant just skip the nighttime anytime you want . ofcourse i can use some close range single shooting weapon then but why can i be hex sprayed from something thats 50 hexes away ? its like nighttime is insta smoked area 360 degrees around you , its really not a good feature if u think about it serious for some time .
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Niamak on October 22, 2015, 02:42:08 AM
Yes, the first solution is not really about using CQC weapons but more about "will you try to make up for it ?" by thinking about it, taking into consideration, etc... "You can leave the buildings" exactly solution 2 similar to "You can leave when nighttime".

Let's not stray too far way from the main topic.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Vector on October 22, 2015, 03:22:52 AM
One thing about nighttime your guys probably missed, sniper builds still have more fov than others, even on max malus value.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Caboose on October 22, 2015, 05:02:04 AM
1) I think if you allowed NV scope or goggles in utility/head slot then player is making their own decision to take them, thus sacrificing smoke or med kit etc or something as equally useful in said slot. E.g. Helmet that negates head cripples/blind.

2) I used to be against tunnel vision and night malus, but have learned to adapt, now generally take 2 BG's (1 BG sniper + Minigun) and usually a pistol and although generally not as useful as a tougher build, still can contribute in close quarters battle. Each player must decide if they want to play pure builds or more universal.

3) Although I agree that 'running away' and 'leaving the core' are viable strategic options for battle when conditions are not right. Fighting should be encouraged, not discouraged. At a point in time where fights are sparse, these conditions do contribute to a fairly miserable time in the core. 20/30 minutes waiting for fight. Get to core and Lawyers are camping a room, and other 20/30 minutes where Vtec leave the zone because we refuse to fight in 1 hex doorways (rightly so). Another 20/30 minutes where Lawyers decide to leave cupboard and fight in open. Meanwhile several night cycles hav been and gone and only sneakers have had a modicum of combat. Finally, when combat finally arrives my sniper has been reduced to a window fighting with no space to use max range and combat is 9 times out of 10 over in <>10 minutes.

I agree that all these features make a more diverse and fun combat system, but for the average new player, they are probably really put off by it. It took me a long time to get used to it.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: ProfessorYanick on October 22, 2015, 05:52:29 AM
With the existing hotkey binding system the utility slot is not the problem, you should just have quick fingers and count your AP. But the idea of some sort of items taking utility slot for some constant bonus is interesting.

I also think that current combat system is quite challenging for any new player, even those previously engaged in other online fallout projects. But I don't think it is a reason to sacrifice complexity of the game. Instead there should be more elaborate progression system, there people wouldn't be thrown into PVP right from assignment routine. The upcoming tech tier system could be a good call for people learning in a step by step fashion.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Teela on October 22, 2015, 08:49:47 AM
One thing about nighttime your guys probably missed, sniper builds still have more fov than others, even on max malus value.

This sums it all up TBH. Sniper will be at ~50 sight range between ~1 and 3 AM. Rest of the time they will still be out of range for BG/SG and they will always have more FOV. Only thing night time does is making combat less static by forcing the typical max range DSR specialist to adopt a more dynamic play style.

I like playing sniper, and I like tunnel vision and night time because it balances.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 22, 2015, 10:07:21 AM
well i dont know which game u played @teela and @vector but when u got some scoped weapon in your hand in fact your malus is bigger then without it becasue the fov malus calculation is shit and just takes the bonus you should gain from four eyez and x scoped level , dunno what paper sniper builds u made , as a straight malus ... i could debate whole days about this shit SERIOUS .
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: S.T.A.L.K.E.R on October 23, 2015, 01:32:55 AM
You nay? What's your opinion devs.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: cirn0 on October 23, 2015, 11:00:12 AM
It's already in the game since last patch.
Title: Re: Infrared/night vision scope
Post by: Kurwier on October 23, 2015, 03:13:52 PM
my opinion : BLJAD