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Author Topic: Power Armor  (Read 19462 times)

paragon

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #60 on: December 02, 2014, 09:51:09 AM »

Players left long before PA implemented.
First group I've encountered using PA in ZCs were Russian BBoy platoon.
They were playing for 1-2 weeks using 2 PA in battles, it were one of the best tactical and equipment changes during the season.
They have 1+ PA left, 2 lost to v-tec.

You can scare only randoms and scavengers with PA, it's easy to kill. And not much harder to get if you're playing in team (5 men) in this team-based game.

Yes, Family use PA for assignments ^^ But they don't afraid to fight against it, because they probably know about it much more than you, naossano.
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Stem Sunders

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #61 on: December 02, 2014, 10:10:29 AM »

@naossano
I don't think anyone is scared to fight against PA, and the bigger groups certainly dont care about making it fairer and also you're right that little groups can't afford to use/lose it.
but my point stands that it is still in the core. usually on a vtec.
Its hard enough to get players for ZC/PvP and when we do get enough players no one can be botherd to grind and hunt for PA frags, we would rather try to play PvP.

@Paragon
If I had it I guess I would use it, however majority of players I spoken to don't care or don't have interest in using/finding it.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 10:17:21 AM by Stem Sunders »
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Niamak

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #62 on: December 02, 2014, 10:11:39 AM »

AK is an expensive weapon. Kappa
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naossano

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #63 on: December 02, 2014, 11:24:55 AM »

I am aware that PA is not invincible.
And it is not just about fighting an PA but also fighting wearing a PA, while you have good chances to lose.

The Problem that Power armor raises is a a reminder of old grinders/hoarders servers.

- That item involves a lot of grinding. You need to gather x number of players to spend x number of time getting one item, then do the same for another, and another, etc... It is time/energy/people consuming.

- It doesn't provide any attack bonus, of course, but make the tank characters even more bullets/actions points sponges. They stay alive much longer.

- In order to remain active in PVP/ZC/TC, you need to be able to maintain a constant and effective supply line. If you always/often win, the supplies aren't much an issue, as you keep your stuff and get free additionnal stuff. If you you always/often lose, you have to constantly gather new item in order to sustain the PVP efforts.

- In servers in which the stuff is harder to obtain, you have a few PVP team, that are almost always the same, that can afford to grind and hoard thousands of hard to get items,  and those teams are always the same taking zones. In 2238, for instance, the town were almost always held by TTTLA/VSB/BBS/CS/Rogues/C88/sorryififorgotone. It was pretty rare to have another team take a town, let alone hold it. Sometime, a team managed to join the competition, but considering the other team were stronger/more experienced, those new teams lost a lot and weren't able to sustain there supply line. If the items were easier/faster to get, they wouldn't forfeit so easily. And i am saying that as a TTTLA, a member of a team who had enough no-life members to sustain the supply line.

- One of the most welcomed elements of AOP was to make the items easier to obtain/find/produce, so the supply line is less an issue. People can lose a lot more fight and still come back, because they spent 1 hours to be fully equipped, instead of a full day, and all their team. Plus, the randomization of many things makes you wander/explore more, instead of doing the same thing over and over. For players that aren't in the grinding mindset or just want to have fun, it is very refreshing compared with 2238.

- Power Armor, on the other hand, seems to promote grinding a lot more, since it involves having a full crew doing nothing for hours in order to get to the right encounter where they will find those 5-6 guys with power-amor parts, and do that thing again. It contradict the early non-grinding philosophy, is boring, involve going out of the core for a bunch of time, and not meet other players for PVP/RP/diplomacy/any interaction. Some players might be interested in doing it, but many won't just do it, even once.

- Then, there is the issue of the supply line, related to the win/lose thing. If you win a lot, you don't have to grind a lot. If you lose often, you won't bother bringing an item you spent 4-6 hours getting, and risk lose it agains't enemies that would have beaten you 80% of the time. They would beat you even more if they have it and not you.

- Which brings me to the relief to not have seen much people in PA recently. If thought they wouldn't inflinct more balances issues in other groups that already lose tons of lower stuff already.

In the end, my complains mostly have to do with the grinding issues brought from the ways it is obtained, rather than the item itself. I would rather have it linked with the fame. So people would be even more inclined to join the PVP, knowing that even if they lose a billion time, just by coming back and shooting the enemies, they are getting closer to obtain their own power armor one day.

About the amount of players, they were almost an hundred three days before and were fifty a week later, before the change of port. Althought, it can be argued about what would be the cause of players leaving, since the server lost players everyday since mid-september.

Anyway, i don't want to make definitive statement about the Power Armor, since it fit some purpose and will probably be rebalanced someday, but it can be easily understood what feeling the current way to obtain it could put off a significant amount of players, and why some of them left.

Not mentionning the goal of attracting totally new players and casual and let them do significants things early enough that they would want to stay more.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 11:34:47 AM by naossano »
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FrankenStone

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #64 on: December 02, 2014, 11:46:26 AM »

well your grinding aruguments for PA are all great , i was seeing problems there too when it was impletended but i dont think that it need re balancements i mean the armor itself is good as it is , only the grindin is a bit of a problem but dont forget that random encounters were heavily nerfed because of too much whining at the beginning of season , if it wouldnt have been nerfed maybe u could get PA even faster then with proper team ...
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Stem Sunders

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #65 on: December 02, 2014, 11:58:33 AM »

well your grinding aruguments for PA are all great , i was seeing problems there too when it was impletended but i dont think that it need re balancements i mean the armor itself is good as it is , only the grindin is a bit of a problem but dont forget that random encounters were heavily nerfed because of too much whining at the beginning of season , if it wouldnt have been nerfed maybe u could get PA even faster then with proper team ...
I thought it was nerfed after the addition of PA.
Before the addition of PA it was really easy to find BOS in random encounters.
It was also easy to lead them into enemies that might have also been on the same map (Having them fight and picking up the frags from BOS bodies)
Before PA was introduced I got my hands on 6 PA frags doing this all alone.
Now Its a struggle (Very time consuming) to find one encounter with BOS patrol...IMO

Kinda Unrelated question- Are BOS patrols more frequent encounter the less players there are?
Thats how it seems to me, but it could just be coincidence
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 12:02:24 PM by Stem Sunders »
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paragon

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #66 on: December 02, 2014, 12:02:49 PM »

I think fame should worth much more than caps, so for caps you're able to get basic equipment, but tier3 equipment only for fame.
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Stem Sunders

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #67 on: December 02, 2014, 12:12:18 PM »

I think fame should worth much more than caps, so for caps you're able to get basic equipment, but tier3 equipment only for fame.

Tier 3, only for the best/most frequent players? :s
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Count Matthew

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #68 on: December 02, 2014, 12:24:37 PM »

Am I being stupid here, but can't you get PA fragments from the smugglers cove area, from the super mutants?
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naossano

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #69 on: December 02, 2014, 12:39:21 PM »

Dunno about the smuggler, but you can occasionnally find some freelancers that have one part on them.
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paragon

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #70 on: December 02, 2014, 12:41:52 PM »

Tier 3, only for the best/most frequent players? :s

Umh, I forgot to say that basic equipment (like CAmk1) should be free for all xD
Then some better equipment (like CAmk2) should be for caps.
And CAmk3 should be for fame.
(and the difference between them if less than 10% efficiency)

But it won't happen because it's not arena game like John Porno said (:
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cirn0

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #71 on: December 02, 2014, 01:03:59 PM »

The SPA is intended to be just another type of armour instead of a direct upgrade of anything, following our armour design, although I don't think anyone has problems with the armour itself.

The method of acquiring the armour currently is not really well thought out but more of a, "I want to get this combat tested and feed-backed ASAP" kind of thing but with some emulation of difficulty to obtain. So yes its behind a grind right now but the key to this grind being dangerous is that it is all possible to obtain this in the safety of PvE instances (from WM random encounter, PA dudes).

All the best gear ought to be only obtainable in a PvP susceptible environment and most probably only available to obtain during prime-time as daily/weekly events. This is critical to the legitimacy of the whole game's premise because in the grand scheme of things, these items MAY be the deciding factors to the strategical battles ( Outpost fights and Faction HQ fights ). I want to minimize the notion that a certain group is dominate because they had more grind potential and that they have this gear because, they fought smart and won it; earned it.

On paper, all this is done to give pressure to every faction, suppose if one faction rises above the rest a bit, surely it will be pulled down by the collective. This prospective future/feature interests me as a player and hopefully will you guys as well.
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paragon

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #72 on: December 02, 2014, 01:15:27 PM »

Global conspiracy time!
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Smalltime

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #73 on: December 02, 2014, 05:28:36 PM »

Am I being stupid here, but can't you get PA fragments from the smugglers cove area, from the super mutants?
You can. Those guys also drop chitin, t3 ammo, and... datacubes.
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Stem Sunders

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #74 on: December 02, 2014, 06:27:23 PM »

Am I being stupid here, but can't you get PA fragments from the smugglers cove area, from the super mutants?
You can. Those guys also drop chitin, t3 ammo, and... datacubes.

These data cubes...afaik, nobody has ever seen or posses one...

I need to know what data they contain damnit!!
Before the lawyers figure out how to use it against us.
OR WORSE!!
Those filthy tecs get their hands on one...

If they do...All is lost...


EDIT. Everyone has one but me, and I'm just finding out there are also "tech parts/pieces"? XD

 
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 06:55:09 PM by Stem Sunders »
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Smalltime

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #75 on: December 02, 2014, 06:53:13 PM »

V-tech definitely has at least one. I don't know if there are any encrypted ones yet, though.
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Michaellew

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Power Armor
« Reply #76 on: December 11, 2014, 02:44:59 PM »

i have a Power FC on mine and have no issues with driving it around town cold or warm and no starting issues, it is not my daily driver but it is all i use on the weekend.
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Caboose

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Re: Power Armor
« Reply #77 on: December 11, 2014, 05:00:24 PM »

Our Platoon has 2 encrypted datacubes.
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