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[3.14]

Assault rifles have 40+ range, and burst mode, no point in making more weapons just like the ones we have.
1hex -melee
2-7hex -flamer
8-15 -SMG gap
16-30- pistol
31-50- assault rifle
50+ sniper

[Niamak]

Don't forget light and heavy machine guns

[Captain Chilly]

to the guy who said SGs are useless, i beg to differ, the M29 revolver is a wondorous weapon there's the CAW Shotgun and the Remington, along with a variety of assault rifles like the M16, the AK 74 and the FN FAL

[mAdman]

Assault rifles have 40+ range, and burst mode, no point in making more weapons just like the ones we have.
1hex -melee
2-7hex -flamer
8-15 -SMG gap
16-30- pistol
31-50- assault rifle
50+ sniper

Yeah that is what I thought, SMGs would be powerful close range bursters with a pistol equivalent single fire mode that is less powerful than a pistol in its own way.

I would like to see SMG bursts at short to mid range have higher bullets spent in a single burst than say an assault rifle, that way you will deal substantial damage, but at the cost of having to reload more often in burst mode, a bumped up AP cost and the consumption of more bullets.

To clarify I was thinking a burst from an SMG could empty a third or even half of its clip capacity.

[mojuk]

to the guy who said SGs are useless, i beg to differ, the M29 revolver is a wondorous weapon there's the CAW Shotgun and the Remington, along with a variety of assault rifles like the M16, the AK 74 and the FN FAL

If I'm that guy than I said "burst SG" and I still stay by my words. All SMGs' and assaults' burst mode sucks and mentioned revolver or desert eagle is much better than those burst weapons.

[Niamak]

Another problem since INT is so important for skill point and crit chance, you are better off with a crit weapon and burst/full auto mode obviously doesn't crit. 

[MickDick]

Flamer beats smg due to such minor range differences, and extremely high damage differences.
Pistol beats smg by Damage and range and AP cost and ammo...
Assault rifle beats it by all means for obvious reasons unless you happen to be close to it.

SMGs are not "situationally viable" in any situation compared to other weapons.

There is nothing good about the gun.  More range would fix this.  I only said 40 range.  I did not say in what attack modes.

1-25 range for bursting, and 1-35 or 1-40 range for single shots.

This is hardly sniper SMGs anyways, stop being retarded.  Bursting from that range would have so much spread as to do practically no damage.  And aimshotting does so little damage it's only good for attempting to cause a crit effect mostly cripples.

[paragon]

Once I said "1 hexing is not needed, this server is better". But I have to admit bursting with AR and SMG currently hardly useful. Probably it's ok with most of the AR being "middle" gun. But SMG being close range and low damage... need some rebalance

[Deathproof]

Once I said "1 hexing is not needed, this server is better". But I have to admit bursting with AR and SMG currently hardly useful. Probably it's ok with most of the AR being "middle" gun. But SMG being close range and low damage... need some rebalance

Was just about to write that. buffing SMG's 1hex damage would solve the problem and make them specialized weapon.

[Graves]

Hm... what if the Cone for full auto was simply widened some?  Right now the cone is the same for all burst weapons.  I'm not sure how hard it would be to implement such a thing, but it seems to me that adding a few bullets per burst and widening the cone just a *bit*.  Maybe? 

Just a thought, haven't seen anyone entertain this unless I skipped it over.

[3.14]

If smg will do more damage at 1hex then melee, then melee would be useless.
If melee will do more damage, then smg would be useless.
It's not a good idea.

[paragon]

It's not only about damage, right?

[PusiteGA]

i just got raped by Sand Robe dude like f lvl 5 whit some shit handgun i head mp5sd he survived almost dead but holy f it was 4hex max range 
SMG needs boost for sure

i was in Lather 2 and have toughenst

[Neuromancer]

Smg's should be viable weapons in 5-25 range. Some e.g. uzi should be better (nearly as good as melee) at hexing, some ( e.g. mp5 ) should be better at 15-20 range, but in overall those weapons could use some damage buff for sure.

Yesterday I wanted to check silenced uzi and mp5. Fortunately I've found single bluesuit in phoenix. I've been trying to kill him with aimed shots, bursts, even voodoo so i could catch up with pursuit and APs. He was FAing himself and after 4 zone transitions he stopped picked up a barbed spear and I had to run for my life. If I'd use wakizashi it would be instakill, with other weapons it would be a matter of seconds. I was using wrong ammo though ( armor piercing for mp5 ) but still it was a bluesuit -.-

[PusiteGA]

No bost at 1 hexing cuz mele can own you you shoud make it full auto to 5-7 hex all bulets hit and 7+hex  start mising
Dmg boost too so at least can fight vs pistols
For me Uzi shoud get boost in numbers of bulets shooted like 10 insted 5
and MP5 needs boost in DMG per bulet

[Deathproof]

If smg will do more damage at 1hex then melee, then melee would be useless.
If melee will do more damage, then smg would be useless.
It's not a good idea.

Style of play, totally different specials, totally different weapons etc....
It hardly renders any style useless. And nobody said more damage than melee, just buff to usefulness, you won't see SMG having auto KD with like 300 damage for sure. But buff in onehex that would make it useful in specific situations would help them to have purpose in this game.

[faopcurious]

Just give SMG's bleed damage, or suppression.

[PusiteGA]

Just give SMG's bleed damage, or suppression.

supresion would be better but big chance

and +dmg or best thing would be aimed bursts

[faopcurious]

i think bleed damage would make them interesting at least, and maybe some better perks, its not all about damage.

[paragon]

How about more effects like winded and etc? could be an option as well