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[Acidic]

I watched personally today as 2 guys took out 6 just by staggering their shots. With the range thats as good or greater than most guns, and with the Aoe Knockdown... you can just turn a corner and fire with a friend and keep and army of people on their asses. The only downside i can see from it is the fact that you can't shoot when someone is in your face. Though you just have to swap weapon and your fine.

It may sound like bitching... but Im a person who is looking into playing a big gun build and i see no reason at all to use any other big gun. Supression is cool but knock down is better...

TL:DR Bitch bitch bitch, I see words on the screen but all I hear is bitching.

EDIT by Shangalar: could you please not put insults in thread titles? Please behave.

[Myakot]

Grenades can be easily dodged, they are not that easy to aim, they do not have even nearly as good range as any other sniper. Try finding tons of grenades to fire, gl with that. Single smokescreen and any hth with a megapowerfist will end your domination.

[Acidic]

In that scenario... you just fire at the guy HTH guy. Bam hes on the ground as your friend hits him. Not to mention in a ZC scenario (which this whole game focuses around right now.) A hth guy who would charge you will be effectively committing suicide. Then lets talk about how most zc areas have very few spots that a sniper will out range the gl. And the GL would be a dummy to stand in a place were a sniper could take him out.

[Kane]

Wait... grenade launchers do not hit you instantly, if you're camping ass, and do not move around  then it's your only fault.

[Acidic]

You act like someone can tell when they are about to get wtf smacked by GLs. And pre aiming GLs arn't that hard.

[Nunn]

Anything with a knockdown is inherently going to be strong in this game, though this may be a matter of making counter strategies then a straight forward fix.

[Myakot]

In that scenario... you just fire at the guy HTH guy. Bam hes on the ground as your friend hits him. Not to mention in a ZC scenario (which this whole game focuses around right now.) A hth guy who would charge you will be effectively committing suicide. Then lets talk about how most zc areas have very few spots that a sniper will out range the gl. And the GL would be a dummy to stand in a place were a sniper could take him out.

You do understand that hth's run with double voodoos or 1vd 1psycho? He will get you faster than your grenade is going to explode. Besides all HtH characters have all the perks that gain resistance\or fast get-up vs that kind of thing.

[Acidic]

The hth would still be commiting suicide by running in to the enemy group just to punch a couple of GLers.

[Kane]

I still don't know what's your problem - GL is only a CC weapon working inside buildings against a group of enemies, if you're camping you should choose a big building instead of fitting in few hexes, otherwise I don't know what's so OP with this weapon, there are better weapons than this in splash damage (shotguns/flamers)

[Myakot]

The hth would still be commiting suicide by running in to the enemy group just to punch a couple of GLers.

Once again, grenades are not that common that you should waste them on HtHs that are running supersledgies at you. You gain nothing and lose shit ton of uncommon loot, is there any imbalance?
And once again - SMOKES, USE THEM = no problems.

[Fayfay]

I didnt even  knew there is smoke grenades in this game haha :p

Thanks for the info

[Myakot]

I didnt even  knew there is smoke grenades in this game haha :p

Thanks for the info

Look up the first pvp-stream of this game (30 aug.2014) They are damn usefull.
If there were no smokes - snipers would be the best choice for every build.

[Fayfay]

They are no craftable?

[paragon]

Our CC farmer guy is killing shit ton of snipers on zone control.

[Myakot]

Our CC farmer guy is killing shit ton of snipers on zone control.

Are we talking about WorstPlayerEver?
Have never seen him do anything usefull during ZC, just as I did nothing. Besides, he exploited his char way the heck up, all that extra xp he has...

[paragon]

Nope, it's PorkchopExpress. He doesn't participate ZC too often, but when he does, he usually kills more than 5 in battles like 1v2. Spray and dominate.
BTW, tactical use of grenade launchers is standing somewhere out of vision and shooting somewhere close enemy is standing. You don't need direct line of sight and it gives you great advantages.
Everyone now should stop considering battles in sense of Sniper > Burster > CC > Sniper. Cooperate and use your characters in proper way, this way will become really meaningful for the whole group, not just for you.

[Myakot]

paragon ->
This will happen eventually. It's a bit early to make a suggestion about rock-paper-scissors. We didn't even have any t3 fights yet ;P, besides balancing will happen at least every week.

I do NOT say that GLs are weak, they are freaking awesome. I just say that they are not imbalanced, primarily because of ammo rarity.

[Acidic]

Ammo isn't rare... Expensive maybe... A whole S rank mission will get you... what... 70 nades. Thats quite a lot of nades.

Spoiler for Hiden:

But this server focuses around ZC, ZC usually has a defending and attacking team. And Usually the defending team is stuck to a building or a group of them... Which is advantages most of the time... until a grenader or two come... and that WHOLE defending team will get their shit kicked. Since all it takes is some blind fires inside some windows. Hell smokes would work for the nader more than not. Nade launchers are IMO way too good for this type of gameplay. Yes they are counterable... but the counter is super risky and will most likely end in failer since it requires a whole team to offset their position just to make the counter point effective. Nade launchers are "bullshit" .

[Myakot]

Ammo isn't rare... Expensive maybe... A whole S rank mission will get you... what... 70 nades. Thats quite a lot of nades.

Spoiler for Hiden:

But this server focuses around ZC, ZC usually has a defending and attacking team. And Usually the defending team is stuck to a building or a group of them... Which is advantages most of the time... until a grenader or two come... and that WHOLE defending team will get their shit kicked. Since all it takes is some blind fires inside some windows. Hell smokes would work for the nader more than not. Nade launchers are IMO way too good for this type of gameplay. Yes they are counterable... but the counter is super risky and will most likely end in failer since it requires a whole team to offset their position just to make the counter point effective. Nade launchers are "bullshit" .

THAT point of view makes much more sense then the one you mentioned previously .
With this I can sympathize, so, what do you suggest?

[Acidic]

Suggestion. Well... I don't know. Maybe have grenade ammo not buy-able. Maybe make it a special only buy-able in extremely limited quantity and only available when a certain  zone is captured... Maybe make the grenade launchers uncraftable and only available to find or buy.
Hell... make it a reward for one of the special platoon only assignments/Zone Control areas that are being Planned.

Really I have no true suggestions. But I know that when this game is going to get popular its just going to be a grenade spam fest and the defending team is just going to sit with their back on the ground since grenades knock your ass out almost 100% of the time. *shrug*.